THE DIRKCOURSE THREAD

[BrobyDDark]

Please provide evidence and reasoning for your dirk sux or dirk is best boy headcanons and we will argue over whether or not it is correct. This is how discourse is achieved.

Dirk sux

Evidence: he loves Jake, doesn't pay child support, helps fascists

[calamityCons]

Wait what. When has Dirk ever been expected to pay child support. He has children??? Or are you talking about Bro?

[JakeMorph]

do you think smuppet food just grows on sidewalk nature strips?

[BrobyDDark]

Wait what. When has Dirk ever been expected to pay child support. He has children??? Or are you talking about Bro?

Rose and Dave are, like, his ecto-children.

[SbIUsedToKnow]

Please provide evidence

• Wrote my favourite book

• Likes horses unironically

• Loves his friends

• Is aware of his potential and toxic tendencies, and genuinely
  wants to be better for his friends

• Wants to be a mastermind manipulator puppetmaster but sucks at it enormously, talks himself up then fails literally in the next panel. Would not be able to manipulate himself out of a paper bag, but managed to trick a bunch of readers to believe him on face value.

• Has a robot self AND an evil AI self, that's worth +500 cool best character points each

• Is a computer nerd but also an artist and a philosopher, I think those are cool traits to mix together

• Gay

• Very funny

• Anime glasses

• Has an evil AI self and I repeat this one because it's extremely important.

That's all I remember at this point. Feel free to expand the list :).

[calamityCons]

*nods, nods* Alright, fair points, all of them. In the spirit of good natured debate and discussion (I am being sincere here) I shall offer rebuttals for points that I find less convincing, and we can continue have Dirkcourse in the Dirkcourse thread.

• That book is not to everyone's fancy, but I cannot argue against your subjective feelings on a book so this point remains uncontested.

• Liking horses is absolutely a good thing and I'm honestly confused as to how the idea of liking them only ironically even happened because I don't understand Andrew Hussie very well. This point remains uncontested.

• I request evidence of him loving his friends when he has clearly been extremely abusive and controlling toward all three of them. Even if the thinks he loves them, it's clear that his love is shallow or otherwise insincere and actively harmful to others.

• In spite of wanting to be better, it is clear that he failed miserably and skipped to the part where he becomes a huge jackass and continues to be an antagonistic force in Homestuck's reality.

• Claiming that he sucks at manipulating and then immediately saying he manipulated readers into believing him at face value is a contradiction. If he is incompetent at manipulation, how did he manage to manipulate the readers at all? Is it a humorous fluke?

• Alternate selves of a character are ultimately worthless in Homestuck because they are distinct and different people, proven again and again and again. Spades Slick is not Bec Noir and is not Union Jack. Davesprite is not Beta Dave who also is not Alpha Dave. Alt Calliope is not Calliope.

• Having all those unique traits is good and all, and I am glad for the unique combination, but like so many other characters introduced with interesting abilities, hobbies, or combination of the two, he doesn't seem to use all of his assets and occasionally seems to forget about some of his abilities and hobbies. This happens with many other characters as well. (Dave completely forgets about his interests in photography and the preservation of dead things. Sollux fucks off into the Dreambubbles instead of using his psychic powers and laser eyes to do anything important. When was the last time we saw Tavros commune with a fucking animal, and why didn't he commune with Bec Noir? Hey, remember when John and Karkat were stated to have an interest in computer programming and then forgot about it completely? Somewhere out there is a world where Kanaya's rainbow drinker need for blood actually becomes a source of internal conflict for a matronly young woman to deal with literal fucking bloodlust).

• He is so fucking valid for being Gay and I approve of this point.

• This is also pretty true, point taken.

• FUCK yeah, Anime Glasses.

I hope this will encourage an engaging discussion. Like, seriously. I'm interested in understanding Dirk better because we're settling in for the goddamn long haul with this dickwheel for HS^2 so I may as well get to know the main antagonist better. Besides, I think debate and discussion can be fun if all done in good faith.

[Rob]

I love Dirk in the Epilogues - not the choices the character makes, but what the character represents.

Dirk is the literal author for (most of) Meat and we're being given a look into what it means to be Hussie* (or an author at all). Take the Dave kissing Karkat scene: Dirk takes visible pleasure in writing it, making it happen. Dirk!Hussie is the person that, from the beginning, has written the actions of Dave and Karkat, they were never independent beings. Their relationship is fundamentally a fictional entity being written by a fictional entity, but the process of authorship is so enjoyable that Dirk!Hussie can't help but like it when their characters consummate years of tension.

What makes the Epilogues great is that this isn't the end of it, the characters are given agency:
"DAVE: GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY HEAD AND JUST LET ME DO THIS MYSELF!!!"
And of course the fan hivemind literally takes over the story in the form of Alt!Calliope. The Epilogues are, in my mind, less about what happens on the page and more about the tension between a writer, their work, and the multitude of muse-inspired writers.

In the same vein: the `villian' of Homestuck is in a literal sense Hussie: every word spoken and every action taken by Caliborn and friends was written by him. It is necessary for a story for there to be conflict, but that conflict is always the domain of the author and not the villian per se. By placing the author into the work itself in the form of Dirk (a la Pale Fire), then of course it is necessary for Dirk to create conflict in order that a story be told at all.

I'm definitely biased though: the Epilogues/Dirk inspired me to start writing science fiction instead of non-fiction science essays and it's just a blast.

In sum:
====>
====>
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* With apologies to Cephied_Variable and ctset I'm going to refer to Hussie as the primary author for obvious reasons.

[nonsenseMnemonic]

He did have time to change, but he's also a dude that has never asked for help before, and probably wouldn't even consider it. Has this whole complex of raising his own damn self ever since he was an infant. Like, on his own, he'll be like "I have a big, smart, philosophy brain. Maybe if I think really hard, I'll figure out how to be less of a shithead," even though that's what he tried last time.

The closest thing he's got to asking for help is acting out and waiting to get called out on it, which is why he's calling himself the villain. He knows what he's doing is wrong but he can't be stopped.

I think it'd be worse writing if Dirk were any better in the future without any explanation. Kinda like how I'm disappointed by Dave and Karkat became chummy post-retcon through a montage. I'm guessing that's why the Epilogues seemed to make their relationship go backwards from where we once thought it was.

l think just beginning to have those conversations is a form of seeking help, and by talking to Dave about how he felt about himself, Dirk was starting to take those steps. To share your problems with someone else is to expose yourself to their input. He did start to improve in Homestuck.

I'm with you on Davekat post-retcon, but it's also not as if "better without explanation" and "worse without explanation" were the only options the Epilogues had. l don't think no justification worked here, and l don't think it was the only option for retaining the feeling of seeing someone for the first time in a long time, or the only option for making Dirk worse. Relapses happen. Not everyone gets better. But I think it would've been either more interesting to see Dirk continue to improve as he had started to in Homestuck, to see his fall from glory, or to talk at some point about what he was doing and why he needed to be important. I just don't think having him turn out so badly made sense as a natural follow-up to his character or was a neat look into his lost potential. It was disappointing.

[TH4NK YOU B3N]

Understandable. What I'm saying next is unrelated to that.

I like the part in Homestuck where Dirk thinks of himself as a multi-tasking megagenius mastermind but the Autoresponder laughs at that idea. All of his folders are labeled "New Folder," he absent-mindedly leaves swords in the fridge, and in Dave's Pesterquest route he leaves incomplete booby traps around the penthouse. Dave, like Rose, thinks there's some deep passive-aggressive motivation behind his guardian's inscrutable behavior, but I think he just forgets. My guy's a walking ADHD stereotype.

[Cyber-Fan]

I request evidence of him loving his friends when he has clearly been extremely abusive and controlling toward all three of them.

Here's an excellent example of that, courtesy of one of the HS2 writers.

[JakeMorph]

loving someone and being manipulative aren't mutually exclusive phenomena. dirk's whole character is that the awful things he does, in his mind, are ways of expressing how much he cares about people. this applies to both pre- and post-scratch dirk, and his treatment of dave, jake, and the story as a whole. this doesn't excuse his behaviour - but it doesn't mean he 'hates' the people in his life either.

[Joyfulldreams]

EXCUSE ME I'M WRITING AN ESSAY TO DISPUTE THE IDEA THAT DIRK IS LITERALLY EVER MANIPULATIVE OR ABUSIVE EVEN ONCE EXCLUDING THE EPILOGUES. Like seriously I am legit looking for instances of Dirk, in the comic, doing anything actually awful, of Dirk doing anything actually manipulative, or actually abusive, and I'm coming up almost completely empty. The dude is barely so much as even MEAN.

The AR is a totally different ballgame but I'm talking about Dirk and I swear to god if someone tries to come at me about how they are the same person or whatever my essay is going to get that much FUCKING LONGER. ABOUT HOW DIRK LITERALLY ADDRESSES THIS MULTIPLE TIMES. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.

[thorondraco]

loving someone and being manipulative aren't mutually exclusive phenomena. dirk's whole character is that the awful things he does, in his mind, are ways of expressing how much he cares about people. this applies to both pre- and post-scratch dirk, and his treatment of dave, jake, and the story as a whole. this doesn't excuse his behaviour - but it doesn't mean he 'hates' the people in his life either.

I wouldn't be surprised if this whole villain shtick is in some way a means for him to help his friends in a very twisted way.
From what we can gather, had Dirk done nothing or just left by himself never to be seen again, in time all of his friends would die to the Ultimate self. As people become more inward looking the older they get, even if they don't age, they are gonna start pondering like Dirk and Rose ponder. It would open up the partitions and lead to their deaths. And even if they didn't they would be entrapped in the post canon forever.

So the most likely means of preventing both is leading them into a situation where they all become their ultimate selves. Even if its to kill him. And probably force them into conflict with 'the powers that be'

[thorondraco]

EXCUSE ME I'M WRITING AN ESSAY TO DISPUTE THE IDEA THAT DIRK IS LITERALLY EVER MANIPULATIVE OR ABUSIVE EVEN ONCE EXCLUDING THE EPILOGUES. Like seriously I am legit looking for instances of Dirk, in the comic, doing anything actually awful, of Dirk doing anything actually manipulative, or actually abusive, and I'm coming up almost completely empty. The dude is barely so much as even MEAN.

The AR is a totally different ballgame but I'm talking about Dirk and I swear to god if someone tries to come at me about how they are the same person or whatever my essay is going to get that much FUCKING LONGER. ABOUT HOW DIRK LITERALLY ADDRESSES THIS MULTIPLE TIMES. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.

The semi molester robot, forcing Jake to kiss his severed head, kinda strongarming the relationship, his barely repressed narcicism. And generally having a bad habit of needing to be in control somehow.

We see the real bad stuff from Bro and his abusive 'warrior training' that actually hamstringed Dave's ability to be a hero cause he has mad ptsd from living like that.

What we are seeing in the Epilogues is Dirk deciding to no longer have any restraint on his actions and doing what he wants. Likely for the sake of, in a Bro like manner, making everyone else strong. He chose to be the villain, chose to ultimately die, but not before he complete his objectives. And giving into his temptations and power fantasies are a means to that end.

[JakeMorph]

EXCUSE ME I'M WRITING AN ESSAY TO DISPUTE THE IDEA THAT DIRK IS LITERALLY EVER MANIPULATIVE OR ABUSIVE EVEN ONCE EXCLUDING THE EPILOGUES. Like seriously I am legit looking for instances of Dirk, in the comic, doing anything actually awful, of Dirk doing anything actually manipulative, or actually abusive, and I'm coming up almost completely empty. The dude is barely so much as even MEAN.

i respect you but come the fuck on dirk programmed a robot representation of himself that was only ever capable of either beating up or inappropriately fondling jake

[Cyber-Fan]

EXCUSE ME I'M WRITING AN ESSAY TO DISPUTE THE IDEA THAT DIRK IS LITERALLY EVER MANIPULATIVE OR ABUSIVE EVEN ONCE EXCLUDING THE EPILOGUES. Like seriously I am legit looking for instances of Dirk, in the comic, doing anything actually awful, of Dirk doing anything actually manipulative, or actually abusive, and I'm coming up almost completely empty. The dude is barely so much as even MEAN.

The AR is a totally different ballgame but I'm talking about Dirk and I swear to god if someone tries to come at me about how they are the same person or whatever my essay is going to get that much FUCKING LONGER. ABOUT HOW DIRK LITERALLY ADDRESSES THIS MULTIPLE TIMES. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.

People really do forget how much of the bad stuff pre epilogues Dirk did was really bad stuff that AR did. This quote sums it up best

TT: No. Stop.
TT: You did NOT help me out with Jake. At all.
TT: It was just the opposite! You mirrored my personality and presented this warped version of my intentions to him whenever you could "on my behalf."
TT: You played all these aggressive mind games with him, entangled his cooperation with matters of life and death, and somehow roped me into all these schemes while I barely even realized I was just another victim of your manipulation.
TT: And it all comes off like we're a unified front, like these are OUR schemes instead of just your insane horseshit. And it's probably all been so overbearing to him, he just wants nothing to do with me anymore.

- Dirk Strider (human)

[Joyfulldreams]

*nods, nods* Alright, fair points, all of them. In the spirit of good natured debate and discussion (I am being sincere here) I shall offer rebuttals for points that I find less convincing, and we can continue have Dirkcourse in the Dirkcourse thread.

You have opened the fludgates. YOU HAVE OPENED THEM.

I will make note here that I am only going to refer to Dirk Strider as he exists in Homestuck, the comic, because Dirk in Meat is not only I GUESS portrayed as like not actually Dirk but like all Dirks combined or something, and also, the epilogues are bullshit and horrible and I refuse to acknowledge horrible, horrible writing and also everyone and their mother around the epilogues has been practically begging people to disregard the epilogues if they feel like it because they 'aren't canon' and even if I think that's bullshit on their part because that apparently only counts for the parts they don't care about, I'm going to take them up on that anyway because I CAN.

• I request evidence of him loving his friends when he has clearly been extremely abusive and controlling toward all three of them. Even if the thinks he loves them, it's clear that his love is shallow or otherwise insincere and actively harmful to others.

This statement actually made me do a double-take so hard my neck nearly snapped. Not only is this categorically wrong even INCLUDING the epilogues, but I'm not going to because fuck that I'm not going to dig through bad and inconstant writing to try and prove any point about any of the alphas, but it's actually pretty much the OPPOSITE of the truth. Dirk is the one of the alphas that literally gets dealt the most shit from all three of his friends, and he just sits there and takes it because he feels like he deserves it, has been conditioned into feeling like he deserves it not in small part because of said friends giving him so much shit, and oh also even the closest and most actually abusive and manipulative version of him (the AR) literally never treats either Jane or Roxy even a little badly.

Dirk's literal first spoken lines in the comic are to try and make sure Jane is safe. Because he cares about her.

TT: Why have you activated dear, sweet Huggy Bear.
TT: Are you in danger?

Before Roxy and Jane actually manage to get their shit together and talk about the resentment between them re: Jane not believing Roxy about her life, Dirk comforts Jane and tells her not to be too hard on herself over the whole thing.

GG: Am I an awful friend?
TT: Nope.
GG: I'm not so sure about that.
TT: Well, before you go taking a massive sad crap all over your friendship credentials, consider this.
TT: Only she could manage to blow up your computer with a nasty deathloop virus and somehow make YOU be the one to feel shitty about it.

He was also of the firm belief that they shouldn't push Jane too hard on that front, partially because he knew she'd pretty much have to believe them eventually, partly because he empathizes with her and understands all of this future stuff is probably a hard pill to swallow for her and doesn't want to make her feel alienated, because...he cares about her, and her feelings.

TG: le siiiiiign..////
TT: Le sign?
TG: yes le sign you heard me
TT: Do you mean * le sigh?
TG: hmm nup
TG: ima stickin with le sign
TG: goign down with the shit
TG: *shi[p
TG: the S.S. LE SIGN, starring cap'n rolal
TT: What does le sign actually mean in this context?
TG: oh come on
TT: Come on what?
TG: LE SIGN IS UNIVERSALLY UNDERSTOOT TO MEAN TOO BAD HES GAY YOU DELIBERABLY OBTUSE DUNDERFUCK
TT: I mean, yeah, that's what I thought.

And here we get into his shit with Roxy. Roxy, whom everyone adores partly because of Dirk expressing in heartbreaking detail just how much he loves her, and how SHE sexually harassed him for LITERAL YEARS. SPECIFICALLY BECAUSE OF HIS GAYNESS. She made him feel like absolute shit about himself and his sexuality. It's one of the most horrendous things I've seen a homestuck character do to another homestuck character they genuinely care about. And he just TAKES IT.

TT: How is it a thing?
TG: its a thing beaucase if it wasnt a thing then u wouldnt be all like...........
TT: All like what?
TG: well wantin nothing to do w me 4 starties
TT: Don't be ridiculous.
TT: I have more to do with you than any dude could possibly bargain for.
TT: And I like it just fine.

GOD my heart. It hurts.

TG: hes more in touch with his feelins
TG: which just makes me L my FA off since hes a bobot
TG: *robob
TG: **bobob
TG: and he can actually loosen up sometimes
TG: kinda like u used to could
TT: I used to could?
TG: for 1 thing
TG: he doesnt insta shootdown a bip of frisky rp shenans now n then ;)
TT: Yeah...
TT: I kind of wish you wouldn't do that with him.
TG: why the f not
TT: It just seems a little tawdry and disrespectful.
TT: And vaguely exploitative of a still-emergent cognitive entity, whose perceptional frame of reference is difficult for us to comprehend.
TG: oh come on
TG: hes cool a guy just liek you its just he lives in some shades
TT: It rubs me the wrong way, is all.
TG: ohhhh
TG: do uuuuuu...
TG: WANT me 2 rub you the right way ;D
TT: Not really.

Fuck you, Roxy. Seriously. Fuck you. She is literally saying that the AR is 'better' and 'more in touch with his feelings' because he pretends to be straight for her. Roxy knows that Dirk is gay, knows that he has expressed as gently as possible CONSTANTLY that he just literally cannot be into her that way, becomes extremely uncomfortable every time she mentions it and tries to change the subject-- and she just goes ahead and does ERP with an AI version of him and then RUBS IT IN HIS FACE???? WOW YOU BEING GAY IS SUCH AN INCONVENIENCE FOR ME, DIRK, HOW CAN I POSSIBLY DIG THIS KNIFE IN DEEPER?

AND THEN HE JUST GOES AND SAYS THIS. God my heart breaks every single time I read this. He adores her so much and she treated him like shit and he doesn't even CARE. HE JUST THINKS OF BEING GAY AS A MORAL FAILING, I GUESS. ANOTHER REASON HE'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH FOR THE PEOPLE HE LOVES.

TT: So that's how crazy it is for her to think I'm disappointed in her.
TT: I'm not mad at her and I'm not disappointed in her. That's ridiculous.
TT: Want to know what I really think of Roxy?
TT: I'm proud of her.
TT: She's the only one of us who could face her problems and then get down to business and actually solve them.
TT: No endless hand wringing or suffering in silence or any of that bullshit.
TT: She saw she had an addiction. And then decided to fucking fix it. Just like that.
TT: She's probably stronger than the other three of us put together.
----
TT: The truth is, she's the most amazing person I ever knew.
TT: She's everything in a human being I wish I could be, but can't because I'm in my own way.
TT: Honestly, I'm not even sure if I'm worthy of dying next to her.
TT: I think she probably felt bad for hitting on me all those years. Like I was getting fed up with her, or something.
TT: But all it really did was make me feel guilty.
TT: That I couldn't give her what she wanted.
TT: Like, settle down and have a couple weirdo goddamn kids with her some day.
TT: I guess there were times I thought about it. Being all alone on Earth with her and stuff.
TT: I couldn't though.
TT: Have to stay true to myself.
TT: Still, she would deserve it.
TT: Nobody deserves to get all the things they always wanted more than she does.
----
TT: Tell her that I'm proud of her.
TT: And as a person she's everything I wish I could be.
TT: I wish I could be as nice and loving and selfless as her.
TT: But can't.
TT: Because I'm too busy being me.

I'M NOT SURE IF I'M EVEN WORTHY OF DYING NEXT TO HER

How can any human fucking being on the planet read that and think for even one shred of one second that Dirk Strider doesn't adore his friends so much he would literally die for them in a heartbeat? AND DOES! HE DOES! HE WILLINGLY JUMPS INTO DEATH ON MULTIPLE OCCASIONS FOR HIS FRIENDS AND LOVED ONES WITHOUT EVEN A SHRED OF FUCKING HESITATION. HE JUST STICKS HIS HEAD IN A SENDIFICATOR WHEN THE AR TELLS HIM TO BECAUSE THAT'S THE WAY HE MAKES SURE ALL HIS FRIENDS STAY ALIVE. HE TELLS DAVE TO KILL HIM TO END THE FIGHT WITH JACK AND HE DOESN'T EVEN GIVE A SHIT. HE FUCKING SELF-DESTRUCTS UPON SEEING THAT EVERYONE HE CARES ABOUT HAS DIED AND HE COULDN'T PROTECT THEM.

TT: Speaking personally, I'd probably run this sword through my own dick before I could bring myself to kill Roxy. Even for her own good.
TT: So.
TT: When the chips are down, I guess that's how much of a badass I really am.

This is not the only instance where he expresses his EXTREME worry about hurting any of his friends for literally any reason. He's so terrified of the possibility of hurting the people he loves that he ends up accidentally hurting them anyway through his own indecision, inability to communicate how he feels, and just sort of hanging in limbo forever never actually reaching out to anyone--not to Jake to try and date him, not to Dave to try and talk to his idol, nothing and never because he's too scared he'll mess something up, or that he just straight up doesn't deserve for them to reciprocate his feelings at all, and god I'm going to cry I love this boy so much. He hates himself so much and he's so scared and so lonely!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HE'S THE MOST RELATABLE SOCIAL ANXIETY MOOD.

And you want to know something? I wanted to find examples of Dirk being even remotely abusive or manipulative or hell, even MEAN to any of his friends. But you know what? I COULDN'T FUCKING FIND ANY. THEY DON'T **EXIST**. DIRK IS LITERALLY, NOT ONCE, EVER ACTUALLY ABUSIVE TOWARDS HIS FRIENDS. Even when his friends put him through some of the worst bullshit a friend can put another friend through, Dirk rarely ever goes beyond being kind of curt and annoyed. When Dirk is undeniably the one being shit all over.

GT: Does that mean I'll have to deal with two dirks?
GT: One who is MORE MACHINE THAN MAN...
GT: And another who is a computer program you made hahahahahahaha.
TT: That's a super joke.

The ONLY thing that can even be interpreted as manipulative or abusive is with Jake, and the Brobot, when Dirk is 13:

GT: There he is finished.
GT: Look at this spanking iron friend from the future. He is perfect.
GT: Oh shoot dirk he just got blurry and disappeared! What the actual fuck?
TT: Don't worry, that's normal.
TT: Upon activation he goes into Stalking Mode.
GT: Stalking mode??
TT: Yes. He will stalk you in the jungle and strike when your guard is down.
GT: What? Thats crazy why would i want that!
TT: Didn't you want someone to get in scrums with?
GT: Well yeah but... man.
TT: He will give you all the scrums you can handle. Trust me, this will sharpen your combat skills.
GT: I guess youre right.
GT: I was just picturing a little good honest rough housing... why does the whole thing have to sound so sketchy and nerve wracking!
TT: Do you want to hear my grim tales of the apocalypse or not?

And here's where we can finally get into Dirk's shit with Jake because wow is there a lot. This is basically the only, singular instance of Dirk doing anything even remotely manipulative or controlling. But let me make something clear, here. Dirk did not make Jake the brobot and send it to him to kick his ass, or whatever. We are set up to compare the brobot and dirk's giving of it to Jake with Bro and how he treats Dave. But guess what? Dirk is fucking 13 when he does this, and Bro is a grown ass man.

DAVE: i mean
DAVE: maybe its a little different cause relations between peers is a whole other thing
DAVE: its tricky shit and youre both figuring stuff out on a relatively equal footing and youre both at the same point in your lives
DAVE: its not like when one person is older and supposed to be a lot more...

YOU SURE ARE RIGHT DAVE! IT IS DIFFERENT!

Jake is the same age as him, and also the person Dirk has a gigantic crush on. He spent months slaving away on a robot companion for his best friend, and made it look like himself not to be egotistical (though he'll pretend it is), but as what he was hoping to be a ROMANTIC GESTURE. Jake doesn't shut the fuck up about how much he loves to 'roughhouse' and how great at adventures he is.

GT: Yeah yeah. Im a busy fella dirk!
GT: Wikipedia is a lot of letters to type in a thing for a man of action on the go.
GT: Im always doing adventures remember?
TT: That is such bullshit, you sit in your little jungle globe watching movies all day.
----
GT: Wait... these beasts tend to the young??
GT: I can tell you from first hand experience that monsters are totally rotten at taking care of kids!
GT: They do a bangup job of making em scared though. :(

Dirk knows that Jake doesn't actually get out much, that he is scared and lonely and all alone on his island, a loneliness Dirk can obviously relate to. He knows Jake WANTS to go and do all those things he won't shut the fuck up about, because, note: Jake won't shut the fuck up about it. He also knows that Jake is in literal constant deadly danger and it would probably be a good idea if he had a way to get better at fighting and protecting himself that doesn't put him in mortal danger. So in one fell swoop he tries to carefully craft and send to Jake a companion to make him feel a little less lonely, a sparring partner to let him live out his dream of being a cool action man and to help him sharpen his combat skills, and a protector to stop the monsters on his island from eviscerating him. God forbid he make the mistake of taking Jake at his word that he does actually like fighting, and not have the frame of reference to program in a level of challenge that would be appropriate for him, given that he is: 13, and also rather into fighting as a passtime of his own. He makes the mistake of assuming Jake might be even remotely at his own skill level, and level of comfort with a hobby. As 13-year-olds often do. He put a LOT of effort into this.

He tries to downplay how much, obviously, because he is an edgy 13-year-old who is terrified of being emotionally available.

TT: Happy 13th, bro.
TT: I have something for you.
GT: Whoa nelly!
GT: You are too kind my friend. What is it?
TT: It's no big deal, since it's nothin' I wasn't planning on giving you anyway.
TT: I just sort of happened to finish it today.
GT: I think i catch your drift.

He immediately get's No-Homo'd not, once, but TWICE.

GT: The last thing i need on my bday is another installment of and i quote manbro bukkake theater.
TT: You still don't actually know what that means, do you.
GT: Not really? Its your friggin figure of speech man. I gathered it just meant getting slimed like in ghost busters or somesuch.
TT: Kind of. I told you to look it up.
---
GT: A beautiful blue woman from the wild teaches him the ways of her savage culture and also the ways of alien love. Together they frolic in the forest whilst sharing primal intimacy through magic sexual escapades.
TT: Ahahahaha.
GT: Whats so funny wise guy?
TT: To borrow from one of the more benighted sectors of your zeitgeist, that was "so gay."
GT: Excuse me but i fail to see what could possibly be gay about some huge elegant blue men and women having really spiritual intercourse with their tails or something.
TT: Well yeah, obviously not literally.
TT: Jake, where I'm from that word hasn't been used as a pejorative, or even much at all, in a really long fucking time.
GT: But youre from friggin texas! Arent you?

BETWIXT SOME OTHER INTERACTIONS WHICH SEEM VERY MUCH LIKE, IF NOT FLIRTING, ARE DEFINITELY IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION OF "NO HOMO"

TT: Oh cool. It worked.
GT: Hehe. You nerd.
GT: Hes got your slick japanese spectacles and everything.
GT: Why is this a metal man before me or is it none other than dirk strider himself in my room??
TT: One thing at a time, bro. I haven't quite figured out a way to get myself there yet.
GT: It almost sounds like this is something youve given some thought...
TT: Ok well I don't know what you're implying there but why don't you snap that sucker on the torso and fire it up.
---
TT: I guess call it an extra birthday present. But instead of a present that's awesome, consider it more like a weird confession that may change the way you feel about me.
GT: Whoa uh...
GT: Dirk are you... uh...
GT: Saying what i think?
TT: What?
TT: What do you think I'm saying here?
GT: Uh never mind sorry for interrupting.
GT: Should i sit down for this i dont know what to do.
GT: Wait i already am sitting down. Maybe i should stand up?
TT: No, just chill out. Stand up, sit down, whatever. Here's the thing.
TT: You know all these painfully obvious hints I've been dropping? That always seem to be flying over your head?
GT: Ummmmmmmm.
GT: Maybe?
GT: I think i need a towel or something.

God Jake please contain your horny. He just wants to confess that he lives centuries in the future. He could never bring himself to tell you how he really feels after you no-homo him twice and then immediately reject the birthday present he worked really really hard on for you, as a way to express his feelings. He expressed his feelings and got rejected, end of story for him ever daring to try and be vulnerable again. Which is a very 13-year-old reaction, but...HE IS 13.

Now take all of this no-homo mixed messages in with...

GT: Hes been my best friend forever and ive always liked him a lot as a bro.
GT: And years ago i used to joke around with him that we would probably be totally into each other if he was a girl.
GT: But of course that was before i started to realize he was probably serious about those feelings for me regardless.
GT: Heheh come to think of it maybe that was unwittingly poor form on my part kind of leading him on or something?

I THINK IT WAS MAYBE A LITTLE WORSE THAN THAT, JAKE, BUT WHATEVER YOU ARE ALSO A CHILD WHO DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO INTERACT WITH PEOPLE.

THIS, on top of all of the shit Roxy put him through, on top of Jane not even KNOWING THAT HE'S GAY!!!

TG: i found out today taht dirks gonna make a move
GG: A move? You mean, a romantic one?
TG: yes
GG: On you?
TG: omfffgggggg
TG: JANE GET A CLUE
GG: Um.
GG: On me?
TG: no
TG: no my dear sweet janey not on you
TG: ON JAKE!!!
GG: Oh.
GG: Ohhh.
GG: I didn't think...
GG: That...
GG: Hrm.
GG: Are you sure?

SURE DOES SPELL A WHOLE LOT OF DIRK HATING HIMSELF AT LEAST IN PART FOR HIS SEXUALITY. HMMMM. HMMMM. JUST MAYBE. WHICH WOULD EXPLAIN WHY THIS INTERACTION HAPPENS:

TT: I mean, yeah, that's what I thought.
TT: It would just be cool if you'd refrain from tossing about such antediluvian terms.
TG: antediulivan waht
TG: me sayin ur gay u mean
TT: Yes.
TG: ok but terminology aside i dont think im off base!
TT: I don't see how it has to be a thing.
TG: i rly think its an actual thing bro
TT: Once upon a time, sure.
TT: But the world has changed a lot.
TT: Ever peek in a history book between your wizardly indulgences? This is a nuanced topic.

Wow it's almost like this isn't so much that Dirk "doesn't like labels" and is more about the fact that he doesn't like how this particular label is only ever used to HURT HIM. SO OF COURSE HE DOESN'T LIKE IT. And he's trying to seem cool and unfased and gives a 'its not historically accurate' or whatever excuse when he tries to ask Roxy to please, for the love of god, stop, can we not do this again.

I don't even know why I went off on this tangent even I'm just so passionate about Dirk okay.

Okay look I'm finally going to end this post because I've wasted like two hours doing all this and it probably isn't even that good, but I have to give some in conclusions.

Here's Dirk downplaying his own intelligence to make Jake feel smarter. (In stark comparison to every other time he boasts about his abilities, which are pretty much always in an ironic sense or to cover up any potential emotional vulnerability, can't have that.)

GT: Your knack for gadgetry seems to surpass even my grandmas and she was like this big time gizmo legend.
GT: How do you even do this stuff?
TT: I guess from your perspective I must seem hells of "overpowered" in a bunch of ways.
TT: Which I kind of am, like with a ninja sword I'm basically nuts, ok?
GT: If you say so buddy. I can believe it.
TT: Yeah, but when it comes to building stuff you're probably overstating things.
TT: Like for example, if you told someone a hundred years ago you could build a computer they'd probably be like whoa shit, look at this fuckin' genius.
TT: Well actually first of all they'd say, what's a computer, I only know what horses and diseases are and shit like that.
TT: But once you actually tell them what computers are: Jesus dick! You're a wizard.
TT: But from your perspective you know it's not a big deal to build a computer. You just go online and buy a case and a motherboard and some other shit and put it all together.
TT: It's not like you're smelting the goddamn silicon in your basement and making chips in your hermetically sealed, dust-free garage.

Here's Dirk caring about Jane not feeling alienated.

GT: Those are amazing stories. I am so lucky to have friends like you.
GT: Oh snap what about jane! Have you told her?
TT: Jane is...
TT: No. I haven't.
TT: I've dropped some hints and tested her willingness to believe something like this.
TT: It's just not going to fly. It's way too much drop on somebody all at once if they aren't receptive.
GT: Hmm. True but it seems a shame to keep her out of the loop.
TT: Well, tell her whatever you want. She'll likely think she's being fucked with.
TT: Personally, I wouldn't bother trying too hard to convince her. There's no point in alienating her.
TT: Some day she'll be ready to believe things.

And here is me, telling you all that Dirk is not some manipulative abuser who justifies treating people horribly because it's 'for their own good'. Dirk is a child, who is lonely, and has social anxiety, and who doesn't know how to interact with people, and is scared of being vulnerable because his friends hurt him whenever he allows himself to be vulnerable. He is a child who makes mistakes, he misreads situations, and then does not know how to react to those mistakes that he makes, and withdraws into himself. He doesn't know how to apologize properly, because that requires being vulnerable to a degree that he is afraid would get him eviscerated, and spends the rest of eternity beating himself up for every single mistake he makes and if ever he makes excuses for himself, it is to just keep withdrawing from the people he loves because he believes he is too toxic, because of those mistakes he made, and hell even mistakes he DIDN'T make. He beats himself up for shit that is almost completely beyond his control but keeps happening around him anyway, despite how hard he tries to prevent his friends from getting hurt, or how hard he tries to NOT do bad things. He keeps fucking up, and he hates it, he hates himself, end of fucking story.

If Dirk is guilty of anything, it's of the "i guess I'm just too horrible to ever be better, so I'm just going to push everyone away" line of thinking. NOT "I know what's best for my friends so it's okay for me to do things that hurt them." He doesn't know jack shit of what's best for anyone and only pretends to know on the most surface of levels. The moment you peer behind the curtain, often in his talks with AR, you find he doesn't know jack or shit about anything and is just pussyfooting around the idea of 'doing what's best for x' in order to make excuses for him NOT doing something he SHOULD do, like I dunno, TALK TO HIS FRIENDS ABOUT HOW HE FEELS. And so instead of doing the thing that would be smart and emotionally mature, he just curls inward and pretends he's waiting for the 'right moment' while things all fall to pieces around him--NOT OF HIS OWN ACTIVE DOING--and he continues to pretend he's totally got this, guys, totally. He's got this.

(He don't got this, at all.)

I'd pull out more receipts but this has already gotten late and long so HERE WE GO.

ALSO TAZ ALREADY SAID BASICALLY EVERYTHING I'VE TRIED TO SAY BUT BETTER IN FOUR VERY GOOD MEDIUM ESSAYS WHICH I WILL LINK GO READ THEM INSTEAD OF THIS I GUESS.
Pulling the Strings — Dirk as Manipulative Puppetmaster
Horsin’ Around — Dirk as Physical Aggressor
The Deep Blue of Weird Plot Shit — Dirk as Romantic Predator
Tin cans don’t have feelings — Dirk as Unfeeling Robot

[Joyfulldreams]

Seriously after all that stuff I did other people need to come up with instances of Dirk treating any of his friends horribly in the ways people insist that he does. The brobot is the literal only thing, a thing Jake only ever expresses irritation towards (when AR isn't fucking around with it to make things worse) and that was him making a mistake at 13 that he couldn't exactly take back without leaving Jake defenseless against his very real actual dangerous hellmurder island. You can't judge a 13-year-old trying to express his feelings the same was as you should an adult, just, period? And the other alphas did way more fucked up shit to him, thought way less about it, and felt way less bad about it.

And if y'all give me your receipts let it not be in the form of Dirk talking shit about himself because that's just what he does, he is not reliable when it comes to the actual reality of the shittiness of his actions. He'll feel guilty about everything because feeling guilty about stuff is how he Do.

Forget this post it's dumb but I can't delete it. :(

[Joyfulldreams]

EXCUSE ME I'M WRITING AN ESSAY TO DISPUTE THE IDEA THAT DIRK IS LITERALLY EVER MANIPULATIVE OR ABUSIVE EVEN ONCE EXCLUDING THE EPILOGUES. Like seriously I am legit looking for instances of Dirk, in the comic, doing anything actually awful, of Dirk doing anything actually manipulative, or actually abusive, and I'm coming up almost completely empty. The dude is barely so much as even MEAN.

The AR is a totally different ballgame but I'm talking about Dirk and I swear to god if someone tries to come at me about how they are the same person or whatever my essay is going to get that much FUCKING LONGER. ABOUT HOW DIRK LITERALLY ADDRESSES THIS MULTIPLE TIMES. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.

The semi molester robot, forcing Jake to kiss his severed head, kinda strongarming the relationship, his barely repressed narcicism. And generally having a bad habit of needing to be in control somehow.

We see the real bad stuff from Bro and his abusive 'warrior training' that actually hamstringed Dave's ability to be a hero cause he has mad ptsd from living like that.

What we are seeing in the Epilogues is Dirk deciding to no longer have any restraint on his actions and doing what he wants. Likely for the sake of, in a Bro like manner, making everyone else strong. He chose to be the villain, chose to ultimately die, but not before he complete his objectives. And giving into his temptations and power fantasies are a means to that end.

1. Y'all are really tripping on the fact that Jake described the brobot as 'tender' and despite the fact that that was 90% because Jake is a repressed bi and not because Dirk somehow intended for it to moves on him???? Like, wrestling is an intimate thing to do with another dude no matter what way you slice it. There's no way to make wrestling not homoerotic to some degree. Jake said he liked wrestling, and wanted to wrestle, so Dirk made a robot that would wrestle with him, because he could not physically wrestle with him himself. Jake's the one that got cold feet, god forbid Dirk not be able to literally read his mind about what he actually wanted?

The AR is the one who taunts Jake about it to make him even more uncomfortable, in an effort to brute force Jake into acknowledging the Homo, which is the shitty thing. Dirk however, did not do that.

2. Dirk did not force Jake to kiss the severed head. The AR is the one who orchestrated the entirety of Unite: Synchronize, INCLUDING that. Dirk is so far in over his head he loses complete control over everything that is happening, and the AR tells him to 'leave the synchonizing to me'. Jake also correctly surmises that it was the AR who orchestrated that whole scenario.

3. 'Kinda strongarming the relationship' how? Where did you get this idea that he did that on purpose? The fact that he blames himself for it after the fact? Dirk constantly talks about how there are other factors independent of himself that act without his control or his consent, but how to any outside observer it looks as if all of these separate moving pieces are part of some kind of overall machination he has going on when they are super duper not. He can't say they aren't him, though, because technically they are byproducts of mistakes he has made, and as such he wants to take responsibility for them even when he had basically no reasonable amount of control over the situation at all. The AR is the hyper-aggressive asshole who does the 'strongarming' at Jake because Dirk refuses to do anything out of being paralyzed with fear and indecision, so AR thinks he's 'helping' by forcing the matter. Dirk can't say the AR is WRONG about Dirk's intentions, because he isn't, and feels like it would be irresponsible of him to completely disavow everything the AR does, so he doesn't. He can't just shut the guy off either, because he feels responsible for creating this life that is a separate consciousness with like, rights and stuff, and it would be inhumane to just turn him off. The brobot acting in weird ways Dirk didn't intend because the AR either tampers with it or because it's just another splinter that acts weird or whatever is also not really in Dirk's control, even if it looks like it is, but he can't exactly say it ISN'T him because he doesn't want to admit how NOT in control things are and also because it is technically sort of him!!! Which is why he says that he "bullied himself into bullying jake into liking him" because it was just a whole lot of shit Dirk had very little say in making it harder and harder for him to figure out what the right thing to even DO is.

Also can we please acknowledge the fact that Jake isn't actually some innocent babu who is naught but a victim? HE'S the one that led Dirk on, that knew about Dirk's feelings for a longass time and said nothing, and yes, please also note HE LIKED DIRK AND DIDN'T NEED TO BE BULLIED INTO ANYTHING, BECAUSE HE ALREADY WANTED TO DATE THE GUY, HE JUST FELT WEIRD ABOUT IT BECAUSE HE WASN'T COMFORTABLE WITH HIS SEXUALITY. Jake has agency!!!! He likes to pretend he doesn't but he super duper does!

4. NARCISSISM?????

IN WHAT UNIVERSE IS DIRK STRIDER A NARCISSIST? He is the exact opposite of a narcissist???? You know he's joking when he talks about how great he is at stuff, right?? That's just him covering up for insecurities??? Like an edgy teenager would do??? Because he is an edgy teenager??? Just go ahead and call every memelord 16-year-old boy a narcissist, then I guess. Jesus christ. Narcissist. Really.

5. Bro is not Dirk, Bro is also an adult who took on responsibility for a child who is dependent on him. Dirk is a teenager who should NOT be held responsible for all of the other people in his life, and yet constantly finds himself thrust into situations where he kind of has to or else everything falls to shit. Of course, things falls to shit anyway, because Dirk is a teenager who should not be responsible for his peers in the same way an adult is responsible to a child.

6. The AR is Dirk letting go of restraint and just being a shitlord. Like, we already got that. And the epilogues are unnecessary and don't deliver literally any kind of satisfying story because we just decided to do a 7 year jump to the very end of his devolving character arc and then expect people to just not notice I guess??????

[TH4NK YOU B3N]

Your post is really good and I don't have anything I'd like to refute.

GT: And years ago i used to joke around with him that we would probably be totally into each other if he was a girl.
GT: But of course that was before i started to realize he was probably serious about those feelings for me regardless.

I never would have guessed. Not that I’ve spent much time contemplating issues related to gender. I’m pretty secure in my expression of masculinity, and...

You know what? Fuck this. I don’t owe anyone an explanation of any sort on this topic. I’m confident with who I am, what I am, my gender, as well as my understanding of the concept.

Did Dirk contemplate gender or not? Idk, I'm just kind of sad. I wish Dirk (real Dirk, not the Brain Ghost) and Jake could be nonbinary mlm together. I mean, I wish Dirk were some flavor of trans in general, but you brought up Taz's medium articles so I guess that's why I'm going with that one right now.