Trans Reveals and Gender Parity

[egg]

That is kinda because slenderman doesn't have story at its center. Scp foundation, creepy pastas, touhou and other such things a basically Concepts and settings rather than a story that has been told already.
Homestuck of course has potential for that kinda shenanigans but the reality is it has a central story already. And generally fans would want to affect this central canon too if they had the chance to leave their mark. Rather than just figure out their own sessions in universe.

if Scp did 8in fact have a central story peeps would clamor over leaving their mark on it however haphazardly.

Leaving a mark on something first necessitates that such an action have meaning. If your story doesn't have a central canon that people take for granted, any alterations to it don't really merit acknowledging.

[thorondraco]

That is kinda because slenderman doesn't have story at its center. Scp foundation, creepy pastas, touhou and other such things a basically Concepts and settings rather than a story that has been told already.
Homestuck of course has potential for that kinda shenanigans but the reality is it has a central story already. And generally fans would want to affect this central canon too if they had the chance to leave their mark. Rather than just figure out their own sessions in universe.

if Scp did 8in fact have a central story peeps would clamor over leaving their mark on it however haphazardly.

Leaving a mark on something first necessitates that such an action have meaning. If your story doesn't have a central canon that people take for granted, any alterations to it don't really merit acknowledging.

Which is what i just said. Homestuck does in fact have it no matter the metaphor or jargon being thrown around about 'death of canon'. Its all in universe references.

[calamityCons]

Slenderman does have what you’re asking for, Draco. In fact, he has three. Marble Hornets, Everyman Hybrid, and Tribe Twelve. The SCP foundation has popular Verses where certain facts are immutable, such as the verse where nobody can die, and the verse where the SCP was forced to go public after a scandal in Korea. They still have their own nuclei of canon and the writers and fans of these pieces of Unfiction all understand that.

And you’re so fucking right dude. No amount of insisting the Canon is Dead buzzphrase will magically make it true. The way they’re approaching this is bad and we don’t like it.

[thorondraco]

Slenderman does have what you’re asking for, Draco. In fact, he has three. Marble Hornets, Everyman Hybrid, and Tribe Twelve. The SCP foundation has popular Verses where certain facts are immutable, such as the verse where nobody can die, and the verse where the SCP was forced to go public after a scandal in Korea. They still have their own nuclei of canon and the writers and fans of these pieces of Unfiction all understand that.

And you’re so fucking right dude. No amount of insisting the Canon is Dead buzzphrase will magically make it true. The way they’re approaching this is bad and we don’t like it.

Or you are taking something that was always meant to be metaphorical seriously? Metaphorically it is fans taking over canon because Hussie, seemingly deliberately, selected fans to help him make Hs^2 and other homestuck related stories and products.

Seriously this is Hussie, you have to work through his irony, nonsense, and genuine statements cause they are all the same tone most of the time. Though i suppose miscommunication is often to the fault of the person communicating. Still we never know. Maybe once Hs^2 has ended he does something crazy.

Though this is increasingly getting away from the primary subject of the thread.

[MorganMustDie]

Slenderman does have what you’re asking for, Draco. In fact, he has three. Marble Hornets, Everyman Hybrid, and Tribe Twelve.

mfw i still see people calling Marble Hornets a slenderman story when the creators have been very clear that it was intended as a separate character using a very inspired design

[calamityCons]

mfw i still see people calling Marble Hornets a slenderman story when the creators have been very clear that it was intended as a separate character using a very inspired design

Sorry Morgan. The Operator has just become part of the Slenderman mythos ó.ò

[MorganMustDie]

Sorry Morgan. The Operator has just become part of the Slenderman mythos ó.ò

[Dream Muttman]

The Operator became Slenderman's true name, and his Maskies became a whole thing, too. The Slenderman multiverse was gigantic but it borrowed heavily from the big three.

What this means is the canon was decentralized but still connected to the root of the fandom. It's hard to say if Homestuck is capable of going that route because it really has no competitors and is pretty old at this point, but it could definitely go the comic book route and just have different continuities with different mechanics and characters.

[thorondraco]

The Operator became Slenderman's true name, and his Maskies became a whole thing, too. The Slenderman multiverse was gigantic but it borrowed heavily from the big three.

What this means is the canon was decentralized but still connected to the root of the fandom. It's hard to say if Homestuck is capable of going that route because it really has no competitors and is pretty old at this point, but it could definitely go the comic book route and just have different continuities with different mechanics and characters.

Question is if it can do that and remain meta about it?

One of the important cores to Homestuck is its meta nature and that the meta is an in universe mechanics. The 4th wall in homestuck doesn't separate US from homestuck, to put it simply. That is another layer of reality altogether. Presumably the 6th wall from what Hussie said. Maybe an nineteenth wall even.

I think the general rule of paradox space is if we see something happening via any form of media so long as it is written and drawn, it is happening in their universe in some capacity. The current stipulation in our reality is that it is canon if it is made by hussie or someone hussie asked or hired to make it.
Which in a sense is already a potential factor even now. Hussie has seemingly before adopted headcanons and popular theories, much like whatever that Operator thing is. Just that it is an individual thinking and looking at the collective consciousness of the fandom and deciding if it is included.

Essentially the creator is also the gatekeeper judging ideas and letting them in. Remove the gatekeeper and you would have the collect consciousness judging then. And the collective consciousness, especially now, is capable of such extreme opinions that can contradict each other that it would be hard to solidify anything. Basically cause people would argue on 'what made homestuck homestuck?'

also i am referring to Hiveswap and Pesterquest. Cause it feels like they aren't going the route of 'this is just side content' like the majority of series where they have a 'comic continuation' but it never is referenced in the show and the show staff never reference it at all. that can't even happen in Homestuck cause doomed timelines. Basically it would be subversion if they ultimately had a part to play in Homestuck^2. Which is like a second tenant after Meta, subversion.

[thorondraco]

Realized we were getting rather off track on the topic but people wanted to talk about this particular topic so i made a seperate thread for that topic in particular.

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=588

Discuss there if you please and lets get back on track in this thread's discussions.

[calamityCons]

Thanks for taking the initiative to make that new thread, draco.

[MorganMustDie]

so if i understand this thread correctly, the operator is trans?

[BrobyDDark]

so if i understand this thread correctly, the operator is trans?

Yeah we've been saying it wrong, its not Slenderman its Slenderma'am

[thorondraco]

so if i understand this thread correctly, the operator is trans?

divert into the thread i linked XD

[TH4NK YOU B3N]

happened to look at this thread because i was going through the moderation log thread. still haven't gone through the thread in full.

John to me was always the most straight of any of the other characters; "I am not a homosexual" and all that.

haha

John's claim that he is not a homosexual originated from a time loop. Information transferred back in time from John, to Karkat, to John in this manner is often false.

Like these pages:
https://www.homestuck.com/story/1394
https://www.homestuck.com/story/1667
https://www.homestuck.com/story/1903

Whether it's a false statement or not, it is something John actually believes. This is unlike the other ontologically paradoxical memes.

GG: i would rather ideas came from the place they actually came from

Point is, this is not something John came to a conclusion to because of introspection.

CEB: um, wow, i don't know.
...
CEB: i don't think i have ever actually liked a girl before in that way, so i am not really sure what i am supposed to feel or do...

On the same day he expresses that he doesn't even know he likes girls.

[TH4NK YOU B3N]

if you want symmetry for assigned sex, it doesn't matter whether prospit or derse have an equal number or not. (see calliope and caliborn. yeah i know they don't actually have sexes, but it's introduced to us as if they do so ok)

characters we now know are trans that were introduced as their preferred gender: kanaya, vriska, sollux

so you could choose any troll we already know as male from the start, excluding eridan and sollux, to be the second trans man.

that leaves equius, tavros, karkat, and gamzee.

since equius is seen wearing a maid dress, and tavros was going to be march eridan, i would like to exclude them too.

That leaves Karkat and Gamzee. There's probably more people who headcanon Karkat as trans, but that's because he's more popular in general.

I'm partial to trans Gamzee because I think somewhere Hussie has said that the codpiece is actually a pocket that he stores stuff in. (I don't remember where this was said) Which would make it a phallic fanny pack. Plus there's jokes about how everyone assumes he has a boner even though a codpiece, if anything, hides whether you have a boner or not because it's erect either way. In a dream logic way, his god tier being fake is like saying his dick isn't real (which is pretty rude of people to point out i mean nobody asked) And the god tier outfit is literally made of out dreams. his big dick energy and his big dickishness energy are just so powerful that we are all forced to acknowledge him as a weird sex icon.

[Dirk is] spending way too long staring at a startlingly phallic piece of installation art, the provenance of which Jake doesn’t know, but could hazard a guess it wore a codpiece

that's the prosthesis (strap-on) he needs for his disability. lol.

SOLLUX: fr0m n0w 0n i sh0uld just wear a shirt that says d0n't ask me ab0ut my disability 0r my m0rtality. then everything w0uld be fine.

thanks ghost chad.

thankfully this installation piece is never shown so i can just make random guesses.

if someone tells me that i'm being offensive towards my own gender i will be very displeased. i am projecting on the clown bae because i like him.

[theartvoid]

Additional fuel for a trans reading of Gamzee, maybe?



[MSPA wiki] [Wikipedia]

Granted, it's a bit of a stretch, and human culture =/= troll culture. But I still kind of like the idea of Gamzee having been given a feminine hatch-name (or w/e trolls would call it) and then just hanging onto it even after coming to terms with IDing as a gender other than girl.
(This is coming from someone who doesn't really plan on changing their own legal name either.)

[tajazzled]

so jogn is ace?

[rookie1978]

iii think you are forgetting that time he literally gunned down Gamzee, multiple times, despite him having no threat to his existence. He is literally an incarnation of negative emotion and behavior.

though it is true that Caliborn becomes very much attached to the leprechauns, far more than he was with Gamzee, though this attachment dies when he becomes Lord english. Perhaps it was a result of having half of gamzee? Presumably the eviler half?
I wouldn't say that Caliborn is exactly trans friendly, especially if it involved transition to female nouns. He would probably be selective in his 'wokeness' and only accept trans men cause, to emulate Caliborn's thought process, "OF COURSE THEY WOULD WANT TO BECOME THE STRONGER, SUPERIOR SEX. ITS ONLY TO BE EXPECTED."

'mentally barfs'.

.. wait a minute. Caliborn IS technically trans! O>O
If we apply the species deal, Cherubs are hermaphrodites, if of a more supernatural quality. They literally are genderless and sexless. In a sense they are 'nonbinary' in the truest sense. Not even talking Asari shit here. Meaning that for a species that does not have a binary in terms of Sex or gender, adopting a gender would be becoming transgender to them.

But then that means that calliope kinda untransitioned or something. Is that a thing? I am not super versed in all the nuances. Calliope readopted the gender-neutral state of her species.

In caliborns situation, gunning down the freaky purple clown with a literal felt cock who won't leave you alone is nothing short of a good idea.

Caliborn ultimately did nothing wrong. He was just playing the game.

[rookie1978]

Kanaya made an attempt at a sarcastic joke by claiming Vriska cursed her bulge. They're taking it as confirmation that Kanaya has a penis and thus is trans.

But all trolls have bulges. There was literally never a single thing in homestuck that confirms bulges are trollspeak for dick.