THE VRISCOURSE THREAD

[BrobyDDark]

Vriska is a bad person

Yeah, she's the baddest, in a Michael Jackson's Bad kinda way.

[PilotBlackSmith]

Vriska is a bad person

Yeah, she's the baddest, in a Michael Jackson's Bad kinda way.

I mean kind of? I like Caliborn, Spades Slick, HSC and Gamzee despite them being literally the worst pieces of shit in the comic but Vriska just feels worse for some reason

[melonLord]

Just to throw my two cents in here: I really, really wish so much of the Vriscourse didn't revolve around trying to figure out if she's a Good or Bad person, because that is, just. Easily the least interesting and usually least productive way to analyze her. Vriska is a fascinating character, but so much of her character depth (certainly more nuanced than "she's a sadist who likes doing evil things" lol) gets swept up in circular efforts to try and triangulate her exact position on the Pro8lematicness Chart and it is just. So boring.

Like, the Tavros thing for instance. I think one aspect that gets frequently overlooked is how much of that toxic mess was rooted in Vriska's attachment of her self-image and self-worth to the legendary stories of her ancestor, and the equally legendary relationship between Mindfang and the Summoner. So many of the things Vriska did to Tavros (crippling him, constantly mocking his weakness and disability, attempting to make him "stronger", attempting to force a bizarre red romance that they both clearly didn't actually want, etc.) were either attempts to force him into that role and recreate this legacy that she's invested so deeply in, or take out her frustrations with his and her inability to do so, which of course all ties back to alternian societal customs and ideas regarding ancestral legacy, bloodcaste expectations, etc.

And that is still, I cannot stress enough, deeply fucked up! Like, just an incredibly, undeniably fucked up series of things to do to a person. I think basically everyone is on board with that. I defy you to find a single person unironically saying "no, it's good that vriska has done this, actually" ("vriska did nothing wrong" is a meme and always has been). But I am just so much more interested in dissecting why she did what she did and the many utterly fucked social circumstances around her, and how that affects her life, worldview and relationships, than I am in numerically quantifying how much of a Bad Person that does or doesn't make her.

But sometimes it feels very difficult to even start that conversation, because in some circles anything more nuanced than "Vriska is bad and if you empathize with her you should feel bad" will see you labeled a Vriska Stan, and Bad. Which is a shame, because she's an incredibly interesting character, but plinking her isolated Good and Evil actions back and forth like some kind of demented communal judgement clock in an effort to settle on her objective Did Something Wrong-ness Attribute is, at least in my opinion, just about the least interesting thing you can do with her.

[egg]

69ae0a06-48c8-4d14-abd7-29c41f2604e1.png (457.03 KiB) Viewed 54173 times

[PilotBlackSmith]

[calamityCons]

PREACH

[Ralsei]

PREACH

I mean it's true. Check out my signature to see why.

[BrobyDDark]

PREACH

I mean it's true. Check out my signature to see why.

Now listen 'ere-

[egg]

PREACH

I mean it's true. Check out my signature to see why.

Did you really buy an entire .com domain just to set up a rick roll?

[Ralsei]

PREACH

I mean it's true. Check out my signature to see why.

Did you really buy an entire .com domain just to set up a rick roll?

Yup.

[Wing]

Just to throw my two cents in here: I really, really wish so much of the Vriscourse didn't revolve around trying to figure out if she's a Good or Bad person, because that is, just. Easily the least interesting and usually least productive way to analyze her. Vriska is a fascinating character, but so much of her character depth (certainly more nuanced than "she's a sadist who likes doing evil things" lol) gets swept up in circular efforts to try and triangulate her exact position on the Pro8lematicness Chart and it is just. So boring.

Like, the Tavros thing for instance. I think one aspect that gets frequently overlooked is how much of that toxic mess was rooted in Vriska's attachment of her self-image and self-worth to the legendary stories of her ancestor, and the equally legendary relationship between Mindfang and the Summoner. So many of the things Vriska did to Tavros (crippling him, constantly mocking his weakness and disability, attempting to make him "stronger", attempting to force a bizarre red romance that they both clearly didn't actually want, etc.) were either attempts to force him into that role and recreate this legacy that she's invested so deeply in, or take out her frustrations with his and her inability to do so, which of course all ties back to alternian societal customs and ideas regarding ancestral legacy, bloodcaste expectations, etc.

And that is still, I cannot stress enough, deeply fucked up! Like, just an incredibly, undeniably fucked up series of things to do to a person. I think basically everyone is on board with that. I defy you to find a single person unironically saying "no, it's good that vriska has done this, actually" ("vriska did nothing wrong" is a meme and always has been). But I am just so much more interested in dissecting why she did what she did and the many utterly fucked social circumstances around her, and how that affects her life, worldview and relationships, than I am in numerically quantifying how much of a Bad Person that does or doesn't make her.

But sometimes it feels very difficult to even start that conversation, because in some circles anything more nuanced than "Vriska is bad and if you empathize with her you should feel bad" will see you labeled a Vriska Stan, and Bad. Which is a shame, because she's an incredibly interesting character, but plinking her isolated Good and Evil actions back and forth like some kind of demented communal judgement clock in an effort to settle on her objective Did Something Wrong-ness Attribute is, at least in my opinion, just about the least interesting thing you can do with her.

This. Just. Everything this says

[TH4NK YOU B3N]

Did Vriska think Tavros would sprout wings and fly if she pushed him hard enough? The idea that this terrible revenge cycle happened because Vriska was too stupid to know any better is pretty funny to me.

[melonLord]

Did Vriska think Tavros would sprout wings and fly if she pushed him hard enough? The idea that this terrible revenge cycle happened because Vriska was too stupid to know any better is pretty funny to me.

Well I never said it was a rational thought process. A lot of it wasn't even a thought process so much as a tangled ball of frustration, inadequacy, and internalized propaganda all being influenced by an omniscient cueball pedophile.

[TH4NK YOU B3N]

Did Vriska think Tavros would sprout wings and fly if she pushed him hard enough? The idea that this terrible revenge cycle happened because Vriska was too stupid to know any better is pretty funny to me.

Well I never said it was a rational thought process. A lot of it wasn't even a thought process so much as a tangled ball of frustration, inadequacy, and internalized propaganda all being influenced by an omniscient cueball pedophile.

well, i love it. i love that grown adults would say "i would never forgive vriska for the crime of having a crush on someone at eleven human years old."

vriska telling tavros to apologize for being disabled makes more sense in this context, because if tavros flew then she wouldn't have to feel guilty. it's insane troll logic, but uh. it's not wrong? it's just impossible.

[Flame_Warp]

it's insane troll logic,

Ba-dum-bum tcchhhh

[aspiringWatcher]

Hoo boy the Pesterquest route did add a bunch of irons to the fire didn't it.

[Leddy]

Hoo boy the Pesterquest route did add a bunch of irons to the fire didn't it.

I think the recent Pesterquest route contributed in a nice way to it. I'll be honest with you on that one.

The way Vriska is handled in Tavros route is, in my opinion, nothing short of great. It doesn't entirely villanize Vriska and it even shows that there is some point to what she does, at least in her twisted thinking. Yet even showing that, it still shows Vriska is clearly in the wrong. Even on the side where she steals the attention from his route, as soon as MSPAR agrees Vriska just ups and abandons Tavros in a way that's not backing her point up and is making her look worse, even though you chose her side.

Beyond that, what we get out of Tavros' successful route beyond that is good, but it's not necessary to this Vriscourse discussion dare I say.

[TrickleJest]

all vriskcourse is actually irrelevant. people dislike vriska because shes a fucking asshole and people like her because shes a fucking asshole. her charactet really is that simple

The best quote.

[Katte]

I like her because everything she did wrong, she did because she really wanted to be right, because she wasn't sure she was and couldn't see any other way...

[irishTunes0701]

She's okay. Not the best but is still pretty cool. However, you can't say she did nothing wrong.